From britdisc-owner@csv.warwick.ac.uk Wed Oct 10 13:06:58 2001 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by pansy.csv.warwick.ac.uk (8.11.6/8.11.6) id f9ABdoW20511 for britdisc-outgoing; Wed, 10 Oct 2001 12:39:50 +0100 (BST) Received: from daffodil.csv.warwick.ac.uk (root@daffodil [137.205.192.30]) by pansy.csv.warwick.ac.uk (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id f9AB2QX10412 for <britdisc-real@pansy.csv.warwick.ac.uk>; Wed, 10 Oct 2001 12:02:27 +0100 (BST) Received: from emampx001.pwcglobal.com (emampx001.pwcglobal.com [193.131.169.221]) by daffodil.csv.warwick.ac.uk (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id f9AB2BC12366 for <britdisc@csv.warwick.ac.uk>; Wed, 10 Oct 2001 12:02:26 +0100 (BST) Received: by emampx001.pwcglobal.com; id MAA03877; Wed, 10 Oct 2001 12:02:02 +0100 (BST) From: <ian.stebbing@uk.pwcglobal.com> Received: from emabuf001.ema.pwcinternal.com(10.250.44.210) by emampx001.ema.pwcinternal.com via smap (V5.5) id xma002707; Wed, 10 Oct 01 12:01:31 +0100 Received: from uk-emamta003.ema.pwcinternal.com by emabuf001.ema.pwcinternal.com (PMDF V5.1-12 #U3931) with ESMTP id <0GKZ00418L6Q7S@emabuf001.ema.pwcinternal.com> for britdisc@csv.warwick.ac.uk; Wed, 10 Oct 2001 11:59:15 +0100 (BST) Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2001 11:59:15 +0100 Subject: Re: Team sizes To: britdisc@csv.warwick.ac.uk Message-id: <OFB486423F.849D96C5-ON80256AE1.003A4BB9@ema.pwcinternal.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on UK-EMAMTA003/UK/INTL(Release 5.0.6 |December 14, 2000) at 10/10/2001 12:02:09 PM Sender: owner-britdisc@warwick.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Geoff, Seeing as how no-one else has commented! Team sizes used to be smaller, particularly before the advent of the Tour. This was mainly because it wasn't necessary to have more than about 12 players to do well, although Hombres who ruled outdoor British ultimate for a number of years generally had a few more players. Now to win a tour event you need to play 3 of the top sides in the country on Saturday, beating 2 of them at least and then beat the 2 succesful teams from the other pool in games to 17+ points (usually 19) to win. Doing this with less than 15 players is difficult because of the amount of energy required to run hard for 5 games lasting up to 2 hours in 2 days. This is far beyond what a proffessional footballer or rugby player would be asked to do and often leads to comments from the likes of Gerard Houllier of bias against his team if they have to play approaching this in 12 days. To compete at a European or World Clubs event a team must have a minimum of 12 players, with 10 available for each game or they forefiet that game. I think the move would be to squads of up to 20 players for major tournaments where all the games are going to be close and only tournaments with a mix of opposition quality allowing smaller squads to compete. Limiting squad numbers would hurt the development in this country and put our club teams at a disadvantage when playing abroad. In terms of other sports, they are all moving towards our model. Football used to allow just 1 substitute, now in European competion the manager can choose 3 subs out of 8 available, in Rugby subs were only allowed if the player was medically unfit to continue now they are used as a tactical part of the game. Not sure of the rules in Basketball but the NBA teams seem to have very long benches, and NFL teams choose 11? players on the pitch at any time from a squad of about 40? Ian Stebbing ________________________________________________________________________ Sent by: owner-britdisc@warwick.ac.uk To: britdisc@csv.warwick.ac.uk cc: Subject: Team sizes First, and most important thanks to everyone who made last weekend go spoothly, and thanks to everyone we played (BAF, Leeds, Clapham 2, Sharks) after 4 months off, it was great to have another run around. At the end of a season, I thought now was a reasonable time to make a point that I have been thinking about for a while. And bear in mind while reading this, that it does come from someone who has played in a team of ten all weekend and can now hardly walk let alone run. It seems to me that it would make sense to limit the size of squads that teams can bring to tournaments, or at least limit the size of teams that they can play for a particular match during a tournament. In this way we would first bring our sport in line with almost every other sport I can think of (almost all sports have a limited bench). On top of that, and much more importantly, it would encourage athleticism in the players, something that we are all very proud that Ultimate requires, and also encourage all round playing ability in everyone that plays. Gone will be the days when players like me who have only made 15 completed passes in the past season (and all of these have been backwards)can still get into teams as purely a D player, and along with that, players who can huck it the length of the pitch, but can't keep up on D will have a harder time making it at the top level. Just my feelings, and some that I know have a degree of support. As to the number we should limit to, 15 would be my idea, but I'm quite sure that decision will not be mine! personal replies welcomed, GEOFF (soon to be axed from Fusion for offencive inadequacies) ---------------------------------------------------------------- The information transmitted is intended only for the person or entity to which it is addressed and may contain confidential and/or privileged material. Any review, retransmission, dissemination or other use of, or taking of any action in reliance upon, this information by persons or entities other than the intended recipient is prohibited. If you received this in error, please contact the sender and delete the material from any computer.