From britdisc-owner@csv.warwick.ac.uk Wed Jul 15 18:14:03 1998 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by pansy.csv.warwick.ac.uk (8.8.7/8.8.8) id SAA09421 for britdisc-outgoing; Wed, 15 Jul 1998 18:11:36 +0100 (BST) Received: from post.mail.demon.net (post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.27]) by pansy.csv.warwick.ac.uk (8.8.7/8.8.8) with SMTP id SAA09404 for <britdisc@csv.warwick.ac.uk>; Wed, 15 Jul 1998 18:11:32 +0100 (BST) Received: from (otto.crispgroup.co.uk) [193.237.6.65] by post.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 1.82 #2) id 0ywV5X-0005bn-00; Wed, 15 Jul 1998 17:11:32 +0000 Received: from [129.1.1.241] by otto.crispgroup.co.uk (NTMail 3.03.0017/1.aia2) with ESMTP id sa007220 for <britdisc@csv.warwick.ac.uk>; Wed, 15 Jul 1998 18:08:02 +0100 Received: from [129.1.11.55] by homer.crispgroup.co.uk (NTMail 3.03.0012/1.aia2) with ESMTP id sa018608 for <britdisc@csv.warwick.ac.uk>; Wed, 15 Jul 1998 18:08:02 +0100 Received: by raviben810.crispgroup.co.uk with Microsoft Mail id <01BDB01C.548950A0@raviben810.crispgroup.co.uk>; Wed, 15 Jul 1998 18:13:56 +0100 Message-ID: <01BDB01C.548950A0@raviben810.crispgroup.co.uk> From: Ben Ravilious <Ben.Ravilious@crispgroup.co.uk> To: "'Britdisc'" <britdisc@csv.warwick.ac.uk> Subject: RE: Advance notice Date: Wed, 15 Jul 1998 18:13:50 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Info: Crisp Computing Mail Server Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by pansy.csv.warwick.ac.uk id SAA09412 Sender: owner-britdisc@warwick.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Oh great, another flame war. ---------- From: Andrew Tucker Sent: 15 July 1998 17:36 To: Ben Ravilious Subject: RE: Advance notice On 15 Jul 98, at 14:38, Ben Ravilious wrote: > I agree. As long as essentially tart-based teams like your own go on > skimming the cream (or is it scum ;-) from other places this will not > happen. Ben, I hate to say it so bluntly, but I'm afraid once again you are talking crap. In your opinion. Without going into too much detail, UTI formed three years ago, most of its team having played and graduated at Warwick together. As players at the time, we were not widely known, but due to ambition, hard work and perseverance we have improved to form what is still the core of a tour winning team. Sure - you're a great team (the best in UK it seems) Of course a few extra players have joined along the way and a few have left, but it certainly wasn't a case of skimming the cream. To be honest I don't want anyones cream, especially if it's from Gun or Druids! OK, but where do your players live? Would you call yourself a geo team? When was the last time you recruited a beginner? I am generalising here but I suspect the majority of your players dont have a local team they're supporting. Tell me I'm wrong - I'll shut up then! I know the histories of Catch and Chevy are pretty similar, with the core of their teams being based on old Leeds and Manchester Uni teams. > I hope UTI is the last such team to form in this country. On the contrary I hope more players will go on to form their own new teams, using UTI, Catch and Chevron as examples of what can be achieved. Achievment at tournaments. But achievment in your cities/towns/villages? > Whilst > the levelling of the playing field has been welcome in terms of putting > life into the championships your team's existance does nothing for the > development of the sport. Well I'm sorry you feel like that. It would seem to me that the depth and standard of UK ultimate has incresed dramatically over the last few years, in part I would hope to teams such as ourselves. Well the standard is sooo much better now and thats great. But I'm asking if thats at the expense of developing the player base. Perhaps it would be better if we go back a few years to when any good Uni player was immediately snatched up by either Gun or Druids, rather than going on to form a new team of their own. Er...I think not - isn't that practice dying out now? > I say strengthen the "geo" team spec. initially. however, some day soon > the ability to practice together will win through. This is the only bit of sense you've written, practice and hard work are obviously crucial to any successful team. > Hmm. the good graduates invariably end up playing for tart teams it seems. You seem very bitter, is this caused by no-one wanting to play with Red I wonder? Well its hard not to be a bit bitter when you're up against a team who have grabbed the best players from whereever just to win. I'm saying the ultimate satisfaction is in having nurtured them from year zero. Red are a great example of that and I'm very proud of that (cant you guess ;-) We're also becoming a threat so that makes me feel even better ;-) Colin's original email which sparked this thread just seemed odd because here was a player on what started off essentially as a pick up team preaching about bringing on new players! Maybe there's a dedicated team of Colin's out there! Does anyone else have anything to say on this subject? This is a really vital issue dont you think? Discuss.... We WILL get you one day! > Ben > > Up the revolution! > (don't flame us - we'll flame you!) Five tour events and I'm still waiting.... One season and you're smug.... Ben Keep smiling, Andy - Under-the-Influence