From britdisc-owner@csv.warwick.ac.uk Thu Oct 31 10:47:17 1996 Received: from thistle.csv.warwick.ac.uk by clover.csv.warwick.ac.uk with ESMTP id JAA04985; Thu, 31 Oct 1996 09:33:27 GMT Received: by thistle.csv.warwick.ac.uk id RAA17751; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 17:13:27 GMT Received: from mailsun.aber.ac.uk by thistle.csv.warwick.ac.uk with SMTP id RAA17715; Wed, 30 Oct 1996 17:12:04 GMT Received: from saturn.dcs.aber.ac.uk (actually host saturn.aber.ac.uk) by mailsun.aber.ac.uk with SMTP (XTPPst-c); Wed, 30 Oct 1996 17:07:44 +0000 Message-ID: <32778B3A.1A14@aber.ac.uk> Date: Wed, 30 Oct 1996 17:07:07 +0000 From: ALEX EVANS <aae96@aber.ac.uk> X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (X11; I; SunOS 5.4 sun4m) To: britdisc <britdisc@csv.warwick.ac.uk> Subject: Make room for my oar MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-britdisc@csv.warwick.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Status: RO First of all an apology for the ceremony at nationals. We had intended to ensure that the organisers would be free on Sunday afternoon, but this didn't quite come about. I didn't see Aram's original message, only the fallout, but I get the impression that Aram was suggesting some kind of legislation against non-geo teams. I think we're all agreed that regularly practicing geo teams are the way forward in terms of improving the quality of British ultimate, and such teams should be encouraged as much as possible. I also agree that it's a poor sign that three of the top four teams are non-geo and rarely train together. But I really don't think that outlawing those teams as they presently stand is the way to go (and I'd consider any enforced change in composition or restriction on playing at the top level, even phased in over an extended timescale, to be outlawing them). If a group of people want to play together, wherever they all live and regardless of whether they train together, why shouldn't they? And if they're good enough to perform at a high level why not? All the top teams in America are geo for two reasons: 1. It's a big country, you can't travel halfway across it to attend training. 2. The quality of ultimate dictates that top teams train regularly. (I'm fairly sure there's no legislation with regards where players actually live. Even if there were it would be redundant given point 1). Neither of these points apply to Britain, point 1 obviously never will. Which I think is why we're missing the point talking about geo vs non-geo, I think the issue is training vs non-training. Where the players actually live obviously has no direct effect upon how good the team is. Hopefully in the future these non-training teams will cease to exist at the top level, and what I mean by that is that the level of ultimate will rise to point that these teams will either start training regularly, or accept that they can't compete at that level any more. Therefore the impetus must come from below, from training teams improving to the extent that top teams are forced to do likewise, or from the top teams themselves realising that we're not going to close the gap on SW until we step it up. (I think it will happen of it's own accord, although at a very slow pace as things stand. Hopefully the coaching being talked about will speed things up). I think Aram and I want the same thing, but not at the same cost. I believe that imposition of such rules would remove some of the fun from the game, and it's not good enough to say that there's a place for non-geo teams of mates (the 'good teams at the top, spirited teams at the bottom' mentality that was slated by Si amongst others), if they're good enough let them play against geo-teams. Yes, I do have a vested interest in all this. I live in the sticks (Aberystwyth) and play for a non-geo team, but if I'm prepared to travel to Warwick, London, wherever, for training sessions (and I am, sort it out guys) then what right has anyone got to tell me that I can't play for that team, or that I must play for a more local team, or, given my location, that I must completely forego high level ultimate? Thanks to Wayne and the Hughes's for their work at the weekend, I'm sure your jam was the best that money can buy. Alex