From britdisc-owner@csv.warwick.ac.uk Thu Nov 27 20:10:11 1997 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by pansy.csv.warwick.ac.uk (8.8.7/8.8.8) id TAA01258 for britdisc-outgoing; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 19:15:24 GMT Received: from pp2.shef.ac.uk (pp2.shef.ac.uk [143.167.1.32]) by pansy.csv.warwick.ac.uk (8.8.7/8.8.8) with SMTP id RAA09736 for <britdisc@csv.warwick.ac.uk>; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 17:17:13 GMT Received: from agden.shef.ac.uk [143.167.31.254] by pp2.shef.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 1.73 #1) id 0xb7Yu-0003Ua-00; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 17:17:12 +0000 Received: from AGDEN/SpoolDir by agden.shef.ac.uk (Mercury 1.31); 27 Nov 97 17:17:12 +0000 Received: from SpoolDir by AGDEN (Mercury 1.31); 27 Nov 97 17:17:04 +0000 From: "Simon Weeks" <GGA95SEW@sheffield.ac.uk> To: graysd@monetpost.stdavids.ncr.com Date: Thu, 27 Nov 1997 17:16:59 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Student Eligibility - Sorry to those uninterested CC: britdisc@csv.warwick.ac.uk, jpg2@st-andrews.ac.uk X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.42a) Message-ID: <B1054432CE@agden.shef.ac.uk> Sender: owner-britdisc@warwick.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Appologies to any of you are not interested, but as Dave felt it necessary to put his message out on Britdisc I feel those who are interested in this issue should be able to read my response. > I believe these new regulations were the result of attempting to clear up > the ambiguity of old. This was undoubtedly good as they are far clearer > than before. I am however less convinced that they provide the ideal > long term solution. > The rules for this year (as I understand them). > 1. Only full time students (on a graduating course) can play It states in the rules that part-time students are eligible to play along as studying is shown to be their primary occupation (this is just to stop people doing just one hour a week so they can play student ultimate - apparently it has happened in the past!!) > 2. Students may only play for their institution. If their institution > does not have a team then they may only play for their geographically > closest team and they may only play for this team if they practice with > them at least once a week. Would you not agree with this. Surely if you are going to play for a University team you've got to train with them. It's not fair for a University to pull in a few local talents just to strengthen their team for important tournaments. If they make an effort to train regularly and compete for the team in the academic year in question then there is no problem. > 3. You can't play for more than 4 years as a student Remember it is still five years this year. The original message to Britdisc has already caused someone to panic thinking they're ineligible for the tournament this weekend. > These rules presently exclude the following groups of players: > > Staff of an institution Do you really think staff should be part of a University team? Eligible at Open tournaments absolutely, but in Student competitions, we're not trying to find the University with the best staff team! > Students at institutions without a team who don't happen to play > regularly with their "local" student team My sentiments are explained above. > Juniors not at a HE institution Juniors are again not students of the institution so for the two student competitions that we do get a year, let's keep to HE Institution Students. > Very experienced students Now this is a more in depth issue and I have spoke to Norm and Alex (welshy) about this. I am still not convinced about the rights and wrongs of eliminating 'experienced' students, but I feel that when Si Hill and Barry O'Kane drew up these rules they thought long and hard about this rule. However, once again it is necessary to notice that we are only talking about two tournaments a year of the many tournaments that student teams enter. > To my mind the way to look at this issue is from the point of view of > "What is the point of student competition?" When this question is asked > then there are 2 viable models to choose from. > Model 1: Student competitions are to provide competition between > institutions. > Model 2: Student competitions are there to provide a different > kind/level of competition to that of the open > tournaments. With the two competitions that we organise each year we are specifically interested in crowning the best 'student' team in the country. It is a competition between the students of the institutions. It may well be that many student teams have an open team set up around the University team, but 'student' competitions are, as far as I am concerned, to be between the students. I feel that in most cases eligibility rules are fair regarding student competitions, although I would still be willing to listen to other opinions on the issue of whether experinced players should be excluded or not. Hope that clears it up a little, Simon Weeks Student Coordinator